Fruitful Ways to Learn Jewish Texts PT14 - Shmone Esrai PT8- Prosperity & Judgement (Rabbi Gottleib)

so yesterday we talked about the idea of satisfaction that really the blessing that you want from the material world is to be satisfied with what you have um now it also speaks about this year and all its kinds of crops in the Hebrew the word is from the word Bo which means to come it means all the things that are produced I don't think have to think here agriculturally specifically um and it says for the good and this I think doubles the idea that we're not asking for a lot we're asking for an amount that will actually be beneficial so for example if it was up to you to determine how much rain would fall in the coming year you could do some studies talking about let's say in the land of Israel and see what's NE what's necessary and you could say okay if you're asking me so and so many inches of rain but you don't specify how they fall when they fall your words could come true as a gigantic blessing or gigantic curse imagine that all the years's rainfall Falls in 4 days in a row that would be a gigantic disaster there would be gigantic floods destru rtion death the other hand suppose it falls on every day of the year equally then it'll be too thin at any one time to do much good it needs to be semic concentrated during certain periods of the year and other parts of the Year could be without we here typically get rainfall four months a year and if it's enough rainfall then the country flourishes without any rainfall whatsoever in the other eight months so it's not enough to ask to have X amount it's also a question that it should be in fact for the good other commentators point out it's not enough to specify how much you get without knowing how much you're going to have to spend think of the Israeli economy on October 5th if you predicted what it's predict what its prediction would be for May of 2024 without knowing that a giant war was going to take place then your prediction would been entirely different now that it's a gigantic expenditure just in order to pay for the war expenses the economy is going to be entirely different so we we're sping here we want as a blessing and we want it for good because just saying that we should have a certain amount or even a lot doesn't determine that it will be by itself for good and then when we said yesterday satisfy from your goodness I think there's a there's a double message here you could take it superficially of course if you give us if the our interaction with the natural world produces enough to serve our needs so then we'll be satisfied and of course because we have a religious philosophy we know it's coming from you and we'll be grateful to you because you provided it for us but there's a deeper possibility here and that is that it will come in such a way that we'll know it's coming from you satisfy us with what we experience as your goodness coming to us that means that part of the satisfaction comes from the fact that I know it comes from you I see that it comes from you not that it's like interpret it as a as a consequence I we in this land had an experience 20 years ago that we had five years of drought in a row it was so severe that the people who know these things and understand them that with Take 5 years to make it up as a matter of fact that winter was all made up in one winter one rainfall season to the extent that they had floods in Taria by January there had been no rain at all so there was a giant Gathering to pray for rain at the Western of wall if I remember correctly the estimates were something like 100,000 people were there I was on a bus with many many other people going to the wall and one guy there was carrying an umbrella I thought let's see now you know the rain is already three months late I haven't had a drop okay we're going to pray for rain that's true he's bringing an umbrella I mean okay that's I suppose it's nice you know well it started to rain while we were there it actually started to rain while we were there so you go through that experience and you know it wasn't rainy and it's a drought and there's danger and you go and you pray and you get rain on the spot that's the second dimension of satisfy us with your Bounty and this concept is captured in a pair of ideas a pair of Expressions now I will tell you at the outset I'm a little uncertain about it because to me the two of them read very differently and there's a passage in which the rumo uses them one after the other as if they're synonymous so I must be missing something I'll tell you what they say and I'll tell you why they seem different to me one is that it's a Jewish V virtue to be means be to um make do with only a little to make do with only a little the other phrase is to rejoice in your portion now I hear a world of difference between those two phrases first of all if I'm making do with a little if I Define it as a little a little is a comparative term little is always defined in comparison to others when people complain today of the state of the economy and how difficult it is and how little they have what they don't take into account is that they have more than at any time in the last 3,000 years but they're not comparing with the past 3,000 years they're comparing maybe with last year with what they had or with people down the block what they have what the top 1% have it's a different comparison so you talk about little you're a person who's describing what he has in terms of how it relates to others and secondly Mr P means I'm making do that doesn't describe me as happy rejoicing but I'm not uh Angry I'm not rebellious I'm not upset I'm not sad I'm not depressed I'm making do I'm managing which is a Jewish virtue rejoicing in my portion means two things first of all I'm happy and I'm happy with with it because it's my portion now what does that mean is my portion well I guess you might say I earned it honestly so you know I'm it belongs to me but a portion is something which is usually given it's it's a sign to someone I know that this is what God chose for me he had me in mind when he dealt me this hand as they say when he provided me with these resources what more can you have to be to Rejoice over that God is watching me he's he's managing my life taking my circumstances my hopes my dreams my needs my fears all into account and giving me this the very fact that it is my portion from him is what makes me happy those are two very different attitudes and here when we say satisfy us with your good the second level is because it comes labeled or because I see in it something that he chose for me and that being the case that will satisfy me it won't leave me feeling I really ought to have more I really should have done better because this is what was chosen for me okay that's the attitude towards the towards the physical world um one of the names of God we don't have in the EST but it's not a very commonly used name is spelled shin and the talud explains one aspect of the name as saying he is the one who said to the world enough and the picture is at the beginning when the world's created did it was expanding and at a certain point God said enough now don't talk to me about the Big Bang first of all according to the Big Bang the universe is still expanding second of all according to what the tomwood says it's matter and energy that are increasing there's more and more contents to the world according to the Big Bang expansion it's space that is expanding matter and energy are not increasing so this is not a picture of the Big Bang it doesn't mean that 3,000 years ago we knew about the Big Bang we're not saying anything like that but let's let's understand what's communicated by this picture the creation process starts and it delivers more and more the contents are expanding until God says enough what position are you in when you're watching something expand and say enough the position is that this thing that I'm watching expanding is a means to something else when I say enough I mean I have enough for what I'm going to use this for right good enough right and here it's I'm about amount but yeah good enough would have the same say by the way there a wonderful motto in English which I think is very useful the excellent is the enemy of the good because if you demand of yourself only to produce Excellence you won't achieve it and you won't do good things things either if you're prepared to get an A minus or B+ you can do a lot of good if you're only going to turn in a pluses you'll do very little if anything so here it's the physical world expanding and God says enough that means the whole of the physical world is only a means it's a means to something else that's why you can measure it and say enough now that's the attitude which enables us to be satisfied with the amount of physicality that we've achieved because it's only a means if the physical were an ended to to itself the more you have the better why should you ever call a halt but since it's only a means you measure what you have against my my example for this my Parable for this is some of you probably know that in the mountains in New York it's a place where in the fir communities they often spend their Summers the husband works in the city goes back go to the mountain for the weekend the families in the week get in the mountains so there are trips back and forth from let's say New York City to to the mountains 2hour trip three-hour trip the husband's coming it's Friday afternoon well schedule didn't work out exactly to his ideal and it's late and the gas tank is only an eighth full and that's not enough gas he needs half a tank to get there pulls him into a gas station he says give me half a tank and the guy says I'll give you a whole tank well you can't afford it you have a nice car no I need to get there on time I don't have time for the extra gas I need just enough to get there on time so you when it comes to the tag half full you say that's enough I'm going that's what it means to stand outside the physical and look at the physical as a means and then say that's enough so that's the real the the heart of the blessing here you're able to be able to to take that stance V Vis the physical and I want to mention this to you because you have an opportunity I think to experience this while you're here those of you are only here for the summer um go around go out for chabas go to families for chabas go around take a look and see how Jews in jeruselam live I think if you're coming from a a normal American background some of it is pretty shocking could you imagine a family with seven children in three bedrooms one bedroom of the parents and two bedrooms for seven children I don't know what the theories are today but when I grew up it was psychologically recommended strongly that every child have his own bedroom you try suggesting that to a family that you go to my wife has 14 children Le and Har and she lived in small quarters and one time they were living in an apartment and she had six kids in one room and she was able to curtain off an Al Cove from the from the living room at night which would be just a place for one kid to sleep so she said to the six kids which one of you would like to sleep in the alve they said what did we do wrong why are you punishing us I don't want to leave the rest of them I want to be together with everybody else why would I want to be alone oh so maybe it isn't a psychological necessity that every child have his own bedroom or her own bedroom so when you look at the style of life and the level of life no Carpets on the floors just Stone floors okay some places have fancy Stone still you know you think what would happen if someone lived at this level of of of uh physical resources in America he'd be below the poverty line there would be social workers coming in to attend to his needs he'd be on welfare look at them are there people sitting out on the Stoops doing drugs are there people drunk in the streets do you hear about suicides there not really maybe it's possible to be happy and inspired with less of the physical maybe that's a lesson to learn and to think about what am I planning to do how many hours a week am I planning to work how much money am I planning to make what kind of no two cars one for me one for my wife plus as the children become 18 a card for each kid is that what I'm planning for why is it necessary what am I trying to achieve those thoughts are important to meditate on you could gain a certain amount of Direction in life if you took them seriously to think what is the physical going to be used for I I will take this one step further my first mother-in-law had an experience which she shared with us and I think which communicated something very profound she lived through the stock market crash in 1929 you probably read that during that time there were people who lost all their money and committed suicide they jumped off buildings the question was raised suppose such a person while it was alive had lost a child child died would he have jumped off a building did you ever hear of a parent lost a child committing suicide I'd never heard of it well now follow it up suppose in 1927 two years before the crash you had asked this person what do you love more your money or your children he surely would have said his children and he wouldn't have been lying he wouldn't have been lying but look what happened when he lost his money he committed suicide and left his children orphans it means that if he lost a child he could live with that if he lost his money he couldn't live with that so what really is he more invested in his money or his children sounds like his money even though he wasn't aware of it again I'm not saying he was lying but he doesn't understand his own psychology he doesn't realize that losing a child he could live through but losing his money he couldn't live through money has a way of stealing your identity without you even knowing it you become dependent on a certain style of living without knowing how dependent you are and you make all sorts of sacrifices for it not even realizing what you're doing and especially if you live in a society where everyone's doing the same thing then you do it because that's what everyone's doing this exercise what we're learning now what I'm telling you I hope should raise your Consciousness to at least think about it at least think about it so when you go into it you make a choice and you think about the reasons for the choice rather than just following the pack yeah that just be that the person when person has a child child is like external value while the ability to earn money and to have money is something that person takes like like oh that's that's my power that's my value that's what I you know well that's exactly the problem that's exactly the problem but he wouldn't if you asked him what do you love more your money your children he wouldn't say that said because this is my power I love this more and that's why I like my money more than my children he wouldn't say that yeah but if you ask him what makes him great he wouldn't say his shell he would say his money that's the problem that's precisely the problem because he and but when he says he loves his children more he doesn't know that he doesn't realize that he's identifying with his power to make money more than he's identifying with his children that's precisely the problem he doesn't know that he's not aware of that he's he answers I would say culturally in an expected way of course I love my children more and it's not true it's absolutely not true by the way I'll push this a little step further um this is a kind of morbid exercise I'm not recogn mening that you should have to do it but if you think at the end of your life and you think of your Epitaph this your tomb Tombstone let's imagine they write on your epap all the things that you feel you were successful at now you just imagine what would you like to have written on this that Tombstone what would you like to feel that you succeeded in doing in your lifetime here's one that I think May might asking people no one even thinks of that doesn't occurred to them I succeeded at having a happy marriage really I think the attitude of many people about that is fatalistic either it'll be happy or it won't I mean I'll try but it's not in my hands I can't make it happy either I married the right person or I didn't I tried you know I did research we spent time together but you know either it happens or it doesn't but it's not true it's to a very great extent the result of the commitment and the consistency and the and the creativity of the two members in the marriage so it really ought to be that if you think of it as something that you would like written there then you're going to take an entirely different attitude towards it during your lifetime so these are things which same thing with your children you invested more you think of yourself more as a money maker than a father that means you're probably not doing much as a father probably not doing much as a father because no matter how complicated and subtle you have to be to make money it's much more difficult to raise a child much more difficult anyway okay sort of going off on attention Okay let's go on to the next 107 sound the great chofar for our freedom raise the banner to gather our Exiles and gather us together for the four corners of the earth so two symbols here what do you notice about the choice of the two symbols of the announcement of the freedom Sher bner and what's the third one no two I said two two what do you notice about them visual visual or at least relatable like chofar you hear you go one is Visual and one is auditory auditory blowing the Chau far something you here and raising a banner something you see what's the difference between an auditory signal and a visual signal different sens that go to different senses senses yeah but now think socially think socially think economically think think in terms of Effectiveness if you see it it be more effective if you see it be more effective I think you said it right if you see it you're more effective why don't we why don't we give a visual warning warning of a missile attack because people go distracted what why do we give a visual warning of a missile attack effective more people can hear voice I can't hear you more people can hear voice more people can hear voice yeah how many more everyone I mean if it's loud enough everyone will hear it if it's visual then almost no one will see it right anybody who's indoors isn't going to see it anybody's pointing in the wrong direction isn't going to see it anybody's interested in something else it's not going to turn to see it auditor is much more effective that's why all major public signals are auditory they're not visual they don't send us smoke signals they don't wear a flag signal to teach you about something to inform you something okay now here you have two auditory and visual so now to get the visual you have to be with your eyes open pointed in the right direction so if I were writing this prayer I wouldn't write it this way I would change the order I would say give a visual signal that visual signal will be captured by the elite the people who know what the the score is and know what the variables are and know where to find uh signals and they'll they'll catch it right away and then for the rest of the population who aren't sensitive to the visual signal then give the auditory signal that's where I would have written it but since it's not written that way so I'm definitely missing something yeah why can't the audio get people's attention they look out and then they see the okay so now you're answering right that me okay and then you have to say if so why do we need the visual signal at all why isn't the auditory signal enough deliv it when you see something as more impact like okay so I think that's right if that's one of those things that's right that what you see has a much much greater impact it also could be much more specific although you might have different patterns of sounds for different for different for different signals but you you trust your eyes because they give you much more information than than your more than your ears so it could very well be that's that's one way to explain it that the auditory catches your attention but then the visual has that impact now let's take that and use it to analyze something this is not something that's often discussed in the talmud when you want to initiate a discussion there's a certain invitation in the t is TMA come and hear that's the bonian talmud in the Jerusalem talmud it's toaz come and see so it is also in Z come and see those are two in different invitations and the experience that they're introducing you to are different experiences when you talk and and in fact remarks there a verse placed me in a dark place that's Babylonia well in the dark the only way you can communicate is by voice in the light you can show pictures you can give demonstrations in the dark it's only by voice think of the difference voice requires attention and memory because if it's more than two sentences long you got to remember 5 minutes from now what was said at the beginning in order to get the message put it all together if it's visual you can show the whole thing in one shot so auditory is slower and requires a much greater effort from the one who's going to re re receive the signal the visual is much more immediate and has much more bigger impact and it has gives carries greater credibility there a big difference between Babylonia where it says come and hear let's have a verbal discussion versus the Jerusalem tal and the Zohar which is also composed in in Israel where it says come and see and the Capstone is where it says at SI that they saw the voices which means that which is usually communicated by voice received through hearing taking time requiring Memon requiring attention could be absorbed visually none of us understands what that means because it refers to an experience that no one has ever had but you see that the Torah cares about the difference and cares to tell us that at Sinai something absolutely unique happened that these types these two different uh modes of perception were crossed in this way and by the way this is not synesthesia because synesthesia when you hear a trumpet you see red but you hear the trumpet and you see red it's just that there one causes the other that's not that that's syes that's not what we're talking about okay but the the Redemption this the announcement of the Redemption is going to be carried by the by these two types of signals one and that's both these are both based on verses in the tanak authors of the prayer didn't make this up they took it from the writings of the prophets now this blessing in gathering of the Exiles marks a break up until now the blessings that we have had apply to individuals and local communities and local times the first six knowledge and repentance and forgiveness and God investing in our battles and providing uh healing and and health and and and sustenance all of that each individual could say about his own individual circumstances from here on out they're National blessings blessings about our national future ultimately coming to the Messiah which is five blessings ahead and here I think it's important to notice we're now giving where blessings for National Redemption and the Messiah and the first blessing is the blessing of the in gathering of the Exiles if you think that the order here counts then you're going to draw the conclusion we're not relying on the Messiah to bring in the Exiles we only ask for the coming of the Messiah after we ask for the in gathering of the Exiles and that's absolutely correct the order here is based on a tamic passage Milla and this is one of the possible scenarios with which history will close that the in C the Exiles and the restoration of justice and the even the rebuilding of Jerusalem every building the Temple could happen before the Messiah comes there are other possible scenarios but one has to realize that this scenario is legitimate those people who think that we are in the beginning of the Redemption can't be disproved by saying no the Messiah has to do that and if the Messiah isn't here then all of this doesn't count it doesn't prove they're right but doesn't prove doesn't prove that it can't prove that they're wrong by saying the Messiah has to do it because here this being understood as prior to the messiah's arrival that's just a semi political uh remark okay the next one is restoration of Justice restore our judges as in earlier times and our advisors as at first let's see we want Justice we want a Judicial um body which will be faithful trustworthy honest okay I hear that we'll talk about why that's important in a few minutes in why would you put advisors in here what if advisor has got to do with Justice here's a a feature of the Jewish Court procedure there may be other other systems that have to do this as well I'm not knowledgeable enough to say but when you have two litigants who have a dispute and they come before the court and they State their claims the first thing the court does is try to engineer a compromise why would they do that I mean they came for a judgment the law can be investigated facts the facts can be verified and the law often tell tells you when these and these are the claims and these are fact that this is how you should do it give all the money to this one split the money impound the money put them in jail I mean there are lots of things that could happen why would AA advice in particular advice to make a compromise be the first step and by the way one of the ways that this is administered of course if you know this then you can take it into account but one of the ways is this that the judges hear the claims of the two parties and then there's a recess and one judge goes to one party he says listen your situation is complicated I just want you to know as a matter of fact there are three major authorities against your position you should just know that meanwhile one of the other judges goes to the other guy and tells them the same story you should know your situation is not clear it's not obviously going to win because there are three authorities against you and they're both right because it's a controversial issue and there really are three authorities against this one and there really are three authorities against that one that's to soften them up that's to create a doubt in their minds maybe I'm not going to win you know because there are these three authorities against me then when the court offers a compromise they'll be more likely to accept it if they don't accept it and they demand that they want the strict legal realing in the case then the court is Duty bound to give it to them but the first step is to try to engineer compromise why would that be important what function would that serve they're trying to minimize the damage damage might side take Trying to minimize the damage that might occur where where is damage going to come from hold on a second second where's damage going to come from who's going to be damaged is it right to cause the damage wrong to cause the damage or what what else is there that might um motivate the court to try to promote a compromise one they get something one one loses everything okay in this case they both get something let me make the question more pointed to to uh respond to your suggestion let's suppose the judges look at it and say he's going to win if we give him a strict judgment he's going to win which means that according to a strict judgment he should win and the other guy shouldn't get anything why then would we propose a compromise in which the guy who accorded to strict law won't get anything should get something you might think of that as a perversion of Justice peace oh more peace peace between who and who two okay first of all much it's likely that there'll be more peace between the two of them if they agree to a compromise even agree with pain even agree grudgingly that's not the same as the court saying you win and you lose and imposing the loss on the other guy there's a reasonable probability that the guy who loses is going to be bitter it's going to be bitter in his mind it's very easy for him to twist the events and say I didn't get what I deserved if he comes to think that he didn't get what he obser deserved he's going to not trust the court he's going to complain about the court and he's going to be complaining about the other guy because he's going to say he got something he didn't deserve and that's going to cause all sorts of bad consequences between the two of them for sure and also what he will say about the court this happens often it's very difficult for people to accept the fact that yeah two things here to accept for each for each one any one of them to accept fact he's wrong and even worse and worse than my being wrong is say he's right I don't want him to be right I wouldn't mind so much if we were both wrong I would take that but he's right I'm not not taking that so in order to preserve the good reputation of the judicial system in order to preserve some level of peace between the two of them the court suggests a compromise because in the end to answer the question I raised before but it's not fair because he deserves more according to the law if he agrees to a compromise it means he's giving up his legal claim whatever it is okay A person can do that and a person can say look the court case would have taken three months and I haven't got the 10 three months to spend on it it's not worth it if I'm Los if I could have gotten more it's not worth it he's giving it up voluntarily so it isn't an injustice so part of the implementation of justice is that Justice should bring about peace and Reconciliation among people it isn't just the law says and the law was followed end of story there's a care for Shalom together with the idea of Justice it doesn't exist in a vacuum that's it means that the broader context in which Justice operates has to be taken into account in the actual operation of Justice itself this is similar to a plea for mercy I don't know if you've ever seen statues of Justice in the ancient world of the spirit of justice but usually those statutes are blindfolded why because the law shouldn't take into account who's being judged it should apply the law according to the definition of the law that would mean Mercy has no role Mercy says I know I did wrong I know I'm guilty I know the law says I should pay but please don't make me pay excuse me you know we're giving out Justice here but we don't do it that way believe of Mercy is definitely in place and uh and the application of justice is supposed to be together with the desire of creating peace uh now who had a question here that I didn't answer no okay so now look what this blessing says about the lack of Justice restore our judges and ouris first remove from us sorrow and groan because our Jud our judges today don't have the status of the earlier times because they aren't as faithful as reliable as credible as in earlier times we are living with sorrow and groan I saw this with my own eyes I spent I I made two trips to Mexico and in um Mexico City there were 16 million citizens living in Mexico City 3 million homeless I asked people there about the economy and they said we have the natural resources to be the fifth richest country in the world oil and uranium and gold and whoever so why are there so many poor people and the answer is because everybody in Authority steals it and they gave me two examples number one there's a city on the West Coast of Mexico which is owned by one person one person owns the whole city big as a city that's big for even even for for for Los Angeles right how did he do that very simple he was a general in the Army and he commanded the Army to build him a city and that's his City that's graft okay that's graft big using public money to build yourself your own city that was one and the other one the guy was driving me in a car uh and we pulled over for speeding he said watch I'll show you something the cop comes up and and says you were speeding he says yes I was and the cop says give me a dollar so the driver says I was speeding give me a ticket the cop says give me a dollar she says I understand I was speeding I was breaking the law give me a ticket the cop says I have a wife and children give me a dollar stopping people speeding is a way for him to make a living by taking money for the guy who was speeding he not just enforcing the law has nothing to do with it he has a badge so he can get money that's why they're all so poor they're all poor because there's no justice justice is what Engineers the appropriate distribution of the resources that you have and justice is what gives people confidence willingness to play fairly in the context of the society uh you know that in 1989 the Soviet Union fell before that sent people to the Jews who were there the refuseniks to try to help them the kjb always knew who they were and they knew where we were going sometimes they got it some they didn't one friend of mine who was there told me that he was in the park in Moscow and a a musite was there selling burnt out light bulbs wow why would anybody sell why would anybody buy birth out light bulbs here's the answer you buy the burnt out light bulb from the guy in the park then you go to the factory where you work when the supervisor is not looking you unscrew a burning bulb of good bulb and you put in the dead bulb and you put the burn good bulb in your pocket the supervisor comes around and sees a dead bulb he takes out the dead bulb goes to the warehouse gets a bulb and puts a French new one in and he sells the Dead one to the guy in the park got it everybody's ripping off the system why are they doing that because the system's ripping them off big they're slaves to the Communist Party who are living like kings and they're living like like star on starvation so and they know that they don't believe the propaganda that that they're told in pra they know what was so they look for ways to cheat so having a judicial system that you can trust creates the confidence of people that's worthwhile playing by the system because the system is a fair system if it isn't people are cheating if people are cheating then a lot of people are going to suffer a lot of people are going to be victims so the blessing here is very realistic if we don't have judges as were in former times when you can trust then there's going to be groaning and sorrow in the community in the population and that's why we say sore them to to remove from us groaning and sorrow now Reign Over Us you hasem alone H we're asking for restoration of judges and you should be our King you should Reign Over us alone might that not be a kind of contradiction um re over us alone but you have these people who are in authority and they're going to make decisions and they're going to determine outcomes doesn't it sound like they're also reigning over us or or running our lives or you know taking taking charge of things what would the alone mean so that there could be judges and they could make decisions they could decide what the outcome should be but still we would be say that only God is reigning over us how could you work out the two of them together judges can make on a subjective opinion and they canot account or evaluate all the all the fact objectively the only person who even likes the only one who is able to make objective and the most justifi justifiable verdict is God is God himself it's going to be for your own good okay but now that's you're now I think reiterating my problem the blessing starts restore our judges that means the judges should be there we want them back what do judges do they make decisions and as you said they're human and they make decisions on the basis so they best get best understand understanding but it could be wrong it could be even Prejudice in certain ways even good judges could be Prejudice in certain ways shortsighted don't know everything they're eag to certain things and then we say you God you should Reign Over us alone that sounds like a contradiction for the reason you just said re of along with mean all decisions come only from him and from nowhere else but now we just ask for the judges to be restored so how do we live with the two of those together has to be that we can trust that the judges represent what God wants that way they're just bringing to us God's justice now let's press your question but maybe that's not true because maybe their suggestions are are are mistaken the answer to that is God's rule for how the community should run is that we should have judges who make you human decisions with the possibility of mistake that's how he wants it to run there's a famous case in the gamar this has all sorts of implications a famous case in the gamarra where there's a disagreement in the San hedin Sedin is 70 71 members and it was one against 70 Lear took a position and everybody else was against it well decisions are taken by votes it was clear who's going to win but was a very big scholar so they wanted to have a discussion maybe they could come to an agreement Lesar was adamant he took his position the others were all against it there was a certain interaction and finally at the endar said if I'm right let a voice from Heaven Proclaim that I'm right and a voice from Heaven proclaimed and said rebelar is right it's always right okay what to do now well they took a vote it was 70 to1 and the law was s was established against Riv lezar that's a little dramatic how could they vote against him when a voice from Heaven said he's right well Yeshua representing the majority said the Torah is not in heaven Torah is not in heaven so we're not listening to what heaven says wow that's bold you're just sort of ruling God out of out of the out of the consideration right well as a matter of fact fact the words that t is on in heaven were written by God it's the book of Deuteronomy so Yeshua was just quoting what God himself said so in a certain sense God is sort of testing them you have this disagreement 70 against one decisions taken by a vote but I'm going to tell you the one is right how are you going to handle that Yeshua said I'll handle it the way you told us that the Torah is not in heaven okay but then isn't it a little odd that God gave us a procedure which determines a false outcome shouldn't that be questioned why would the system be set up in such a way that sometimes you know you're going to get a false outcome so let me tell you something United States current legal system has exactly the same outcome exactly the same outcome consider the following case in United States law let's suppose that a person is accused of a crime let's suppose the prosecution introduces as evidence a wiretap of his phone they play the recording of his phone in front of the jury and it's absolutely clear that he's guilty no no question about it and then the defense says we have discovered that the police had no court order to tap his phone the police tapped his phone illegally well there's a legal principle in America based on the Supreme Court decision evidence gathered illegally is inadmissible in court you can't use it what happens now well the recording of his phone is thrown out and that's the only evidence he has to go free but everybody knows he's guilty everybody the judge the jury the the the public because it's been publicized and yet he's going free isn't that somehow a miscarriage of Justice No Justice Means using the legal rules not knowing using what you know but leing the legal rules and the legal rules say here this kind of knowledge though it's genuine knowledge you do know he's guilty and you're right he is guilty but you can't use that knowledge to convict that's what the legal system requires here God said I don't want you to use information from heaven in making your legal decisions I want you to make on the basis of your human understanding that's the law I want you to live with that law that answers your question even though Visa the abstract law in heaven they may be not not agreeing with it but in terms of the actual way of of of of uh administering the law that's what God wants yeah there a saying that like in like you know court cases it's like not about what you know it's like about what you can prove um so like with the Torah I guess like since we like know it's true that means it's like it's good to follow is that I don't yes I I think really there are two there are two ISS issues here uh one thing that the the law has to do is decide how should you come to a decision um we have a rule in our legal system that what a person says can't be used against him not only if you torture him but what a person says can't be used against him you have to have evidence other than just just his admission so I say I trust him but I can't use that to decide the case by the way I think I haven't looked this up but I think that this is indicative in American Court in American law when you ask a jury for a verdict what are the two possible verdicts they can give you what guilty or nope guilty or not guil not guilty they're very different because not guilty means the prosecutor didn't prove it maybe he's guilty but he didn't prove it he's not guilty guilty has to mean that the prosecutor succeeded in making a case against him Beyond A Reasonable Doubt and therefore we prounce him guilty by law they didn't say innocent because they don't know what happened maybe he is guilty maybe the prosecutor just didn't find enough evidence or didn't argue clearly enough I think that's that's why it's not guilty or innocent it's guilty or not guilty yeah and there's also the case where where if they convince the jury that he's guilty he might also be innocent the other one that's true so that that okay so I think that also supports the idea that when they say guilty they don't mean that's what happened in the real world it means the legal procedure leads to this uh way in which the law should treat him it's not it's not making judgment about history making a judgment about what the law requires I think I think that's right right anyway so here we have the foundation of what the legal system is supposed to accomplish and who they're supposed to do and as we said it means it's not inconsistent with God reigning over us because we have to be convinced that the legal representatives are doing what God wants done and in particular what he wants is that human beings should use their fallible judgment to make a judgment about what the what should be done and that is what we should follow okay so tomorrow we have this new group coming in