Live Q and A With Mordechai Weinberger and Rabbi YY Jacobson

obviously a lot of different opinions and perspectives, and they go really from one extreme to another extreme. Where some you know, love to slander our generation as the generation of spoiled narcissistic young men and women who think that they're entitled, and they don't know how to uh you know, stay the course. They don't even know the meaning of resilience. The moment they have a headache or they have a heartache, you know, they quit. And a lot of people lament, you know, this generation for being so devoid of the values and the courage and the strength and the fortitude that have characterized our parents and great parents and great grandparents. So many of them who have had lives so much more difficult, so much more miserable, suffered so much both in terms of the loss and the tragedies and torture and whether they came from Russia or they went through the Holocaust, whatever it is. And yet, so many of them, you know, continued with pride and dignity. And today, it seems that for so much less suffering, people just throw in the towel. So, a lot of, you know, there is that perspective. Um And I'm I'm certainly no prophet to be able to know exactly, you know, the exact explanation, exact insight. But I think it's important also to emphasize another point. That's maybe of a different different different perspective, an opposite perspective. And I don't know that the two are mutually exclusive. You know, sometimes there could be many factors that create a challenge and create different patterns in society. I'll just give one example from the field of marriage and divorce. When I grew up, probably you remember, I was born in 1972. I'm thinking if there was anybody in my class who came from a divorced family, and I don't even think one that I remember now. I had a big class in Yeshiva. I grew up in Brooklyn. And I don't even remember if there was one child who had parents who were divorced. I can't remember now. Maybe there was a kid who came in for a few months, but I'm thinking my regular classmates that I went through so many years with. I knew one maybe one one one classmate that at a later point in his life his parents got divorced. It was very very uncommon in our community, right? In the Orthodox Jewish community, divorce was very very uncommon, which was a major blessing. In the secular world, it kept on growing and increasing. It also used to be uncommon. But in the Orthodox world, it was mamish mamish minimal. It was it was unique. It was very rare. Today, you can't say that anymore. Today every day I hear every day or every week I hear about somebody else I know who either got divorced, or they're going through a divorce, or they want to get divorced, they're struggling about. That's a classic example, right? How do you look at this? One perspective is people don't have resilience. Like our mothers knew you got to stick it out with our fathers. You think our zaydes were perfect? You think our alte zaydes were perfect? No, they stuck it out. This is my family. The husbands knew this is my wife for life. This is my husband for life. The good, the bad, and the ugly. And today it's like, no. You don't meet my needs, it's done. And I get that. And I get that and I don't mean to negate that. But I think there's also another side. And that is by divi- and I say this by divine providence, I think we're living in extraordinary times where people want much deeper marriages. In other words, a marriage that may have worked 45 years ago or 65 years ago won't cut it today. Not necessarily because we're spoiled rotten and bratty and selfish, but maybe because we feel deep down that we're capable of having much deeper and more authentic relationships. Maybe because we have more serenity and tranquility in our times. We're not running away from the Nazis or the Soviets every Monday and Thursday. Not to minimize all the tragedies that the Jewish community has faced in recent years. But relatively speaking, you can't compare it to the time of the Bolshevik Revolution, the First World War, the Second World War, etc. Maybe this has created an opportunity where people actually can deal with their emotions. Can actually find themselves and maybe develop a much deeper relationship with their spouse, with their families, with their children, with themselves. But that comes with a price. Because it's messy. If my marriage is just going to be functional on the outside, I'm going to take out the garbage, I'll pay the mortgage, we'll be married together and we'll do Pesach together and Shavuot together and Sukkot together, but deep down there's no real marriage, it's going to look good. For my marriage, for our marriage to be real, deep, authentic, oh, it's going to get messy. I have to deal with my wounds, with my insecurities, just like my wife has to deal with hers. And whenever you're confronting the parts within us that are broken, it gets messy. That's why I wouldn't just negate the generation as saying, you know, nobody has resilience. Maybe there's a search for much more authenticity in all aspects of our life. And that includes mental health, it includes our marriages, it includes our relationship with God. And as a result of that, there are the breakdowns that happen when we're trying to heal. Maybe, maybe, divine providence has given our generation a gift that we could go internal. And our relationship with Hashem and with each other should be much more powerful. So that's what I'm seeing a lot of that today. And if this is true what I'm saying, then it's good news. Because it means that if we can educate a new generation both of leaders and of students that will embrace this challenge with courage and realize that we can guide people to be able to cultivate a resilience that doesn't come from repression or suppression but rather a resilience that comes from embracing all of our parts and finding our deepest calling then we can create the greatest generation ever. Wow. Wow. Wow. I would like to sort of share a Raya to this on a psychological concept. There was a psychologist his name was Maslow and there's a theory called Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Yeah, Abraham Maslow, yeah. Yes. And what he shares is very much to what the Rabb is saying that there are levels. There are five levels of people's needs and the first level is physiological. Like first we have to make sure that we can breathe. We have oxygen. And once you're taking care of that physical level, then there's another level of safety. Like are we actually safe with where we are? So our physical body is safe but now we're going into a much level of safety and security of emotions. And what you're sharing is as follows that many times people right after the war or when we saw certain resilience that we assumed that they were pushing forward or they did things it they were actually doing things but it was on the level of can I live? Can I survive? And what that's what you're sharing about a marriage that it wasn't necessarily always about connection. It might have been two people that had a lot of traumas but we need to right in that right now make this work. There was a friend of mine you're bringing up a story where he shared with me that his grandmother and grandfather were in the TP camps right after the war and this from person goes over to this woman and my grandma was a smoking then a cigarette." And he told her, "You know, I've been watching you sit there, and you look from and I'm from, and I lost my entire family. I'm assuming you're the only person that survived your family. I'd like to get married." And she looked at him, and she tells us to my friend, to the grandson, is saying, "You know, he looked like a nice man. He didn't look like he'll be too difficult." And I said, "Do you know, I have no family at all, zero. Do you have anyone, like an aunt, an uncle, a brother, a sister?" He said, "No, I have no one." She says, "You know, yep, I think I'll marry you." And they stayed married for many years later, and their concept it was that first level of where do we go? Where do we eat? Where do we drink? What What do I have Where am I going to from here? And if that's a level of the marriage or of the relationship, then that's the level of resilience. And I think it's a phenomenal point that you're mentioning that sometimes people confuse the level of which is the highest level of self-actualization. Like, that's what I want to reach, but at the same times we sometimes forget the basics. Like, it's okay if you're not having what you want or if things are challenging. Like, let's not forget the other stages as well, and I think that's the balance. But, it's a phenomenal insight that actually we are having this generation a lot of resilience. We're just aiming for such high places, for such high levels, and that's what's in That That's what That's That's That's what I'm personally seeing in my encounters with many, many students and friends and youth from across many demographics, Jews, literally from all communities. I've been privileged to visit hundreds of communities and speak to people of all ages and of very different backgrounds within the religious and non-religious Jewish community. I'm I'm seeing this type of thirst, this type of yearning as like the prophet says, you know, the Novi says, "Hineh yamim ba'im, days are coming, there's going to be a hunger and a thirst, not for bread and not for water." Lo tzame l'mayim v'lo ra'av l'lechem ki im lishmo'a et d'var Hashem. Wow. What does this mean? It's a thirst to connect to transcendence. It's a thirst for ultimate meaning. I want to tune into the frequency of surrender, to the frequency of faith, to the frequency of love, to the frequency of vulnerability, to different frequency. And to tune into that, we have to confront our blockages, and it's hard to confront your blockages. And unfortunately, there are rabbis, there are therapists, there are doctors, there are psychotherapists, psychologists, psychiatrists who aren't maybe trained textbook, but they're not trained in sensitivity to the soul. And sometimes they know how to create a mess, but don't help people get out of it. There are people who go on journeys of healing, very, very profound journeys. But a journey of healing is incredible and amazing. But we all need a support to be able to find the diamonds within the rubble, within the sand, within the debris. If not, I could just end up with all my dirt. Wow. So, this is this is also very important. This is a very These are faithful moments in history, cuz people are searching for healing. Everybody is searching for I mean, I'm even thinking when I was a bocher, I don't It was unheard of anybody go to therapy. When I was a boy, I I'm thinking my class, I mean, it was I don't think it was even ever mentioned. It wasn't mentioned. When I was a kid, I developed a terrible habit of pulling out my hair. I mentioned it a few months ago on Meaningful Minute. I had anxiety. But it wasn't even a thought to go maybe ask somebody. It's so funny, it's interesting to me. This was the mid-70s. Today, if you don't have a therapist, it's like, "What's wrong with you?" I think you're right. think I could do I don't think I could do a shidduch with your family. Nobody goes to therapy. My point is My point I'm saying it a little bit in humor, but the point is when whenever we there's a really a very delicate balance cuz when we open up the pinemius, when we open up the internal uh struggles we have to have people who know how to hold space for those spaces and help bring redemption and healing. You know, not just the messages, we're all messed up, we're all traumatized, and therefore we should all just get divorced and become lonely people. That's the disaster in the opposite extreme. And there are people that they are not healers, they're just not healers. They may have learned textbooks, they may have degrees. But the real concept of really helping people find their souls, their divinity their unshakable, indestructible selves that no abuse and no trauma can obliterate and destroy this takes not just textbook knowledge, but it takes a lot of inner work. And I always tell therapists and rabbis, and I tell it to myself. It's never about what you have learned, it's never about the information you have learned. That's important. It's about how much work you did on yourself. Yes. You know, I sometimes hear therapists speaking you'll you're a therapist, so you may know what I'm talking about and rabbi speaking and doctor speaking and you could just you know, there's people you can hear you can see that they're worked out. You hear their humility, their vulnerability, their authenticity. And others it's just another it's just another coping mechanism, you know, they've become great therapists. Now they get their validation as healers. But they're you'll forgive me, I'll be a blunt, they they sound stuck up. Uh completely clueless completely not in touch with the rhythm of pain and uh it's it's it it it can be very very damaging, very damaging. And that's why if it's so important that clients and patients should be educated consumers and not rely blindly on people. Could it be could be a disaster. I know a therapist, okay? I'm just giving you an example. And it's important I'm saying this to people You're probably not referring to me. I'm just a simple No, no, no, not at all. I know you for quite a few years and you're an exceptional therapist and an exceptional human being and it's always first an exceptional human being before an exceptional therapist. But just I know somebody and she was struggling very badly and she went to a therapist, a renowned therapist who's been doing this many, many years. And the therapist tells her without even meeting him that your husband doesn't like you. It's obvious your husband doesn't like you. And she almost caused them to get divorced. And the husband tells me she never even called me. She decided that her husband is a narcissist. The husband is thinking about another woman. Now, I happen to know the husband very well. He's a tzaddik. He's a tzaddik. I'm just saying an example. And then I realized the therapist kept her there for eight years because of her own traumas. She needed this patient as a support system for herself. So it's it's fascinating when you have So you have people they're very well-spoken, they're sophisticated, they may be educated but they create disasters. And that's why it's important when you're a client, if your therapist is not a helping you if you're not a calmer person, if your marriage is not being enhanced if all you're being is all you're feel you're falling apart more and more and more then you have to take responsibility for the fact that a therapist is not God and a rabbi is not God and everybody makes mistakes. And that's just important to emphasize. focus on resilience. Um almost what we're saying I I had an idea and tell me what you think of this or by why why that the fact that possibly that people are having now let's say more anxiety or more depression it's because they're now giving themselves the space to feel. Oh, yeah. Possibly that let's say 30, 40 years ago when I was being raised like they it was very much about the behavior. What were your marks? Were you showing up every single day? It was more doing check marks. And therefore our value of who we were were based on the information, but our inner world might have been a little repressed or it wasn't even that acknowledged. And there were impacts like we're seeing a lot of what happened from all that keeping in. So possibly when someone can now express they're actually feeling hurt or they're it's a sign of health that we're able to address this. Right. I'm I'm in agreement with you. That's why it's hard for me to hear when people just, you know, slander our generation as just being spoiled and narcissistic and not putting one foot ahead of the other. I don't agree. I am sure I'm sure we have flaws and I'm sure we should confront the flaws and there may be fat and there may be people affected by these type of currents and trends, but I think what you're saying is fundamentally true at least for so many people. And it's it's it's it's just it's it's unfair. It's unethical. And it's completely it's completely a form of detachment to be able to not realize all of this. So let me share a little the other side. There was just had the the success of being at the Agudah convention. Are you following? You okay? Oh, good. So um just at the Agudah convention they had for 24 hours they had four therapists in advance. Um they had about 400 therapists and rabbonim were there. And it was a supposed to hear from Uri Deitch, which is probably the foremost rabbonim here in Lakewood and general of dealing with challenges and he shared something that was pretty inspiring. And one of the questions was is what's his opinion about the rise in divorce rates? Mhm. He actually said something very interesting. He said from what they're seeing, from what the business seeing, is there actually isn't the rates are not going up. He's saying it's unfortunately at this number. He says, "But it's still 3% as it always was." And he says, "Based on what we're hearing is he says it's because the numbers are so much bigger." And he was saying there's like 2,000 bachurim in BMG at this time that's registered. He says, "And generally, what happens is about 2/3 of them get engaged within the first year." So, he's saying there's almost 1,500 marriages or weddings going on. He says, "And chos v'shalom not to minimize that percentage." He says, "But 3% of 1,500 is something that we would hear, and that's what's happening." So, he was actually sharing on a strength space saying that based on what the Beis Din and what's happening, we're not hearing about that it's that much more happening, but rather Baruch Hashem Klal Yisrael is growing. And along those lines, someone has sent us a message, "Wow, it's so refreshing." Exclamation mark. "I hear so much bashing about our generation, and I also see the most marriages that do survive nowadays are actually much deeper than in previous generations." So, that there's a lot of truth to that about with what you're saying. And I'd just like to share with everyone, for those that would like, you can send your text message either if you're on Zoom, you can put in the chat, you can send us your messages, and I'll read some of them. As well as if you'd like to text in the message, it's the 212-920-5719, 212-920-5719. I guess I would also like to mention um with Rabbi Jacobson that I had the z'chus just about 3 years ago to launch it's just under 3 years the Serenity Center. It's a non-for-profit clinic, and our goal is only to take insurance. So, you cannot pay out of pocket because our role is to be able to bring down the cost of therapy that it should be affordable. Today, if someone needs marriage counseling, that means he's going to go for his individual session cuz he needs his place. She's going to go to her individual session to her place. And And you need the marriage counselor, or one of them will do both roles, or they'll work together. That's three sessions a week. If you're starting at any therapist with let's say 5 years experience, you're talking about $200 a minimum for a session each. That's $600. What happens if anyone's got anxiety? So, Baruch Hashem, I had the zechus of opening up. We have probably today over 40 therapists working by us, trained, supervised, in-person, telehealth, specialists for trauma, specialists for marriage. And I just want to mention for those that would like to know, you got to just have a New York State insurance, but to call up. The number is 845-286-2210. That's 845-286-2210. Or you could just go on our website at serenityctr.com. But the goal is for us b'ezrat Hashem to realize you can get better. Therapists that are there for you, especially hand-picked by me. I also do trainings three times a week for clinicians that they've got to get trainings in the most updated modalities that are out there. And it's practical. Since I am a clinician first, and then all those other titles come after, is it's practical. So, I actually share a let's say a lesson or a method. I then do it with another therapist. So, I do a live demonstration. Then we go into breakout rooms where the therapists have to practice on each other. And this happens weekly. And very soon we are it's going to be mandatory. We're talking about in about 2 weeks, it's going to be mandatory that every therapist Right now we have a big percentage of joining, but it's going to be either you're in and you take my trainings, and we're giving you three options of when to join, or they're not involved. And the reason is because we need to have skills. We need to have We need to build our toolbox. Everyone must have supervision weekly. That's not talking about where they have where we have top supervisors doing that. But we're talking about in particular about training. So, I just wanted to share because of mom is what you're talking about where if a therapist sees one person and they're guiding them for 8 years and we're hearing that it's getting worse, that's a huge warning sign. What's happening? Why is your client not getting better? We have something that the government makes us do once a year and that's called a treatment panel plan. Like, what's the goal that you're seeing the client? By us, we're doing it every 6 months and sometimes every 3 months. We want the therapist to have to say, "What am I doing with this client?" And if you don't know what you're doing with this client, then don't see them. So, it's extremely important with what you're sharing for therapists to know what they're doing and we also have something else. This is all behind the scenes. Not only not only not only not only to know what they're doing, but to confront all of their own wounds in the deepest place. I have found from my years of encounters with people and healers, it's the extent that people have transformed themselves that they transform others. It literally commensurates. It's even when they walk into the room, they know how to look into the eye your eyes, you see different eyes. You see eyes that are worked out, eyes of empathy, eyes of authenticity. I would probably say one of the hardest things that I if I would, let's say, share disclose a little shame or some embarrassment, I could see the difference of where I am now to when I was years ago would be years ago my intention was I Hashem has given me a source of information I can help others. What I have learned through all the years is exactly what the rav is saying right now. I'm not here to help anyone. I am here to heal. I'm here to face my darkest places. Very well. When I can go into those darkest places and I can actually get acceptance, self-acceptance, and if that's with the person that I can join and let me go into those places, then when I have a client and they're starting they're sharing A and I'm going, "Wow, let me tell you I hear C, D, and E." And the person goes, "Oh, I can actually express that to you." Forget about knowledge that I have. In fact, if I could share one of the most insulting compliments that I get that I'm learning to accept as one of the greatest compliments is they tell me, "Mordecai, you're really not such a great therapist. You're just so normal." The fact to be But you know what? That's much more powerful than being a good therapist. Yeah. Yeah. The fact They used to not think so, but today, especially when we know that the deepest wounds are the wounds of attachment, the wounds of abandonment, it's in the relationship, it's in presence, it's in eye contact, it's in feeling the heart, heart-to-heart, it's the frequency of the heart where all healing happens. There's an amazing story I want to share with you. I heard this story from the Lubavitcher Rebbe himself. Uh it's such a It's It's an incredible story. He's He shared this story. It's a story about the Mitteler Rebbe, the Baal Tanya, the Alter Rebbe, the founder of Chabad, Rabbi Shneur Zalman of Liadi, had a son. He succeeded him. He was known as the Mitteler Rebbe, Rabbi Dovber. He actually his yahrzeit was now Tevet, so he passed away Tav kuf Pey Chet. What is that? 1827. Anyway, he lived in Russia and he once traveled and he came to a city and he accepted people what they call in Chassidic jargon yechidus, like an intimate private one-to-one audience. And many, many people came, one after the other after the other, and he was seeing people all day. And then a person came in and after this person, the Mitteler Rebbe closed the door and he said he can't see anybody anymore. And everybody was surprised cuz he came to town and there were a lot big waiting list. And for a few days for a few days, they heard that he was in his room crying, fasting. It was very, very strange. They realized something happened. He was saying to him, he was davening extra, and only after a few days did he open the doors again. And the Rebbe said, the Lubavitcher Rebbe said, "I'll tell you the story. What happened was somebody came in to him. He said this. And he shared with him something about his life that was horrible. And he came to the Rebbe for a tikkun. He needs healing. It was something horrific, horrific he did, real, really heinous. And the Mitteler Rebbe said this. He said, "How do I help people when they come to me? How can I help them? Only one way. I find the struggle within myself. And then when I resolve it within myself, I can exude that. I can share that with them. But this story, I couldn't find in myself. I searched and searched and searched. I couldn't find it. But I realized that God sent him to me, which means I have it. But if I have it and I can't find it, it's worse cuz it's subconscious. It's completely repressed. So that means I have no access to it. So I realized I need to stop everything." And he spent a few days figuring out where this lies in himself. And he says, "And now I figured it out." And he called him back, and he gave him a direction. Wow. And That's That's real That's real That's really That's really what healing is. And it's not just because, you know, he wasn't arrogant. He was empathetic. Of course, that too. But it's much deeper than that. It's almost when you're seeing in your patient a blockage, it's really often a blockage in the healer, in the teacher, in the rabbi, in the therapist. And when I resolve it within myself, the other person can also resolve it. Wow. Wow. Along these lines, there's a concept in attachment and I wonder what the rough thinks about this. And the the muscle that we give an attachment is that let's imagine this 2-year-old kid or 3-year-old child is loses their mother, lose sight of their mother and they're in this huge um let's say in a huge center and they don't see their mother and they're stuck there and kids are going, "Where's your mother? Who's your mother?" And the kid is just frozen and maybe takes the hand, they take them to the security guard and then the security guard announces, "Whoever's missing your child, please come to the security office." And then this mother comes running, "Am I Yiankoula?" And right away grabs Yiankoula and Yiankoula is is is holding her and hugging and then all of a sudden he lets out this huge cry or this shout and now he's crying and crying and crying. And in the attachment concepts, they share that many times when we don't cry when this kid was first alone, he wasn't crying because it wasn't safe to express it and what we call a secure attachment. Yeah. A healthy attachment is when a child is able to be happy when the parents come, cry when they're separated from their parents and then be happy again and be reunited when they're united again with their parents. So this child when they were alone, they weren't strong that they weren't crying. It's not a sign that they weren't afraid. And now when the mother comes, "Oh, he's faking it." It's not true. It's just the opposite. When we're finally safe, we can now release those tears. We can now cry. And I wonder if we take this first what the rough thinks about this and possibly to the resilience theory that is it possible that the challenges that we're having is because people are actually stronger? It's because we're able we want to accomplish more. So, maybe the behaviors are doing less, but we are feeling that much more. We're having as they would say that more intimate marriage, more intimate relationships with Hashem. We're going deeper. We're being possibly more Musar. A lot of everyday regular people that maybe weren't so focused on that just used to have a little bit of Now we're having people sending messages and giving words of inspiration. Is it Is that possible that we're getting stronger with him? I think I think you're touching something very authentic. In fact, I'll tell you something fascinating. One of the great Hasidic masters was known as the Seer of Lublin. You heard of him, the Seer of Lublin. And he writes, it's in it's in his safer, that he heard from his colleague, Reb Zusha of Annapoli. He's known as the Reb Reb Zusha. He was a brother of the Na'eem Elimelech, Reb Elimelech of Leżajsk. Reb Zusha of Annapoli and the Seer of Lublin were students of the Great Maggid of Mezrich. Whose yahrzeit is Friday, Yud Tes Kislev. And so this is what he says, that he heard from Reb Zusha Na'eera Yaya, which means he was still alive. That the Mishna says at the end of tractate Sota, The ikvis Mashiacha, yirei cheit yimasu. Right before Mashiach comes, society will be disgusted with those who fear sin. So, literally it's a very derogatory symptom. It's a very negative reality that we could live in a society where we will detest and be repulsed by yirei cheit, by those who fear sin. Because we will be promiscuous and completely, you know, without healthy boundaries. But the Seer of Lublin says, I heard from Reb Zusha an opposite interpretation. And he says as follows, the ikvis Mashiacha, before Mashiach comes, the Jewish society will be disgusted by those who fear sin, which means they will reject a Judaism that is solely based on fear and dread because they will be yearning for a Judaism that is based on expansiveness and love. Wow. mashiach And I find that to be first of all a prophetic statement by Reb Zushe based on the sages, but also such a psychologically keen insight into the state today. Because it's Fear of Hashem is a mitzvah. We we're not afraid of fear. We we What what what what does fear mean? The Sfas Emes says there's two types of fear. I could fear you, I could fear my wife, I could fear God, I could fear my rebbe, and I'm distance. I like get out of my life. You're a curse. I wish I would have never known you. The fear is paralyzing and immobilizing, but there's a different type of fear. There's a fear our relationship is so blissful and powerful, I'm afraid to lose it. There is an awe. There's a reverence. There's something so precious. Yes, I'm afraid of doing anything that will compromise, dilute, obliterate, and even minimize or weaken the relationship. That's a different type of fear. So, he says, "We come to a time when Jews are really searching." Talk about marriage, for a real marriage with Hashem. Real marriage with Hashem means if my wife tells me, you know, "I don't want to be married to you. I'm just frightened. I'm just afraid." If I'm doing the right thing cuz I'm frightened for my wife, she's going to punish me. What type of marriage is that? I mean, we may stay married, but it's I would say it's pretty empty, and it's pretty miserable, and it's pretty pathetic. Well, it happens to be that for many of us, that's what Judaism looks like, right? I'm frightened of Hashem because he's going to punish me either in this world or in the next world or both worlds. So, I'm doing mitzvahs. I'm learning Torah because I want my peace in paradise. So, what type What kind is that? It's really a very, very empty and impoverished relationship. So there comes a time in history where Jewish people, they want an inner dynamic relationship. They want a relationship that touches them at their core. Like the Balshem Tov used to say, "The s'char mitzvah mitzvah." The greatest reward for a mitzvah is the mitzvah. Mitzvah means tsavta, relationship. The greatest reward of a good marriage is not that your husband is going to give you a gift or that your wife is going to make a good dinner for you. The greatest reward of a good marriage is the marriage. The greatest reward of a relationship is the relationship. The greatest reward for a mitzvah for for relationship with God is the relationship. You know, from from a spiritual perspective, when we can tune into our deepest souls and realize that we are a divine frequency, that's what we each are. We are a divine emanation in this world. We're channels for Hashem in this world. There's no deeper bliss. There's no deeper reward than that. That is the greatest reward. It's being in that relationship. So I think it's exactly what we're seeing, that people are striving for wholeness. In order to strive for wholeness, we have to be able to cry and experience the abandonment, whatever that abandonment looks like. And the fact is that those of us who know what developmental trauma is, and not everybody knows what developmental trauma is. Either you have it or you learned about it. And if you don't know about it, then you don't know about it, you know. I guess you're lucky. But, you know, one of the most painful things in developmental trauma is we reach a breaking point and we create a substitute personality because the pain is unbearable. So if I experienced abandonment from my mother or my father or my other caregivers and I'm a sensitive boy and I couldn't deal with that pain. Right? That part of me broke off and it went into exile. It went into hiding. The Bal Tanya says that Yechiskel says "Va'ani betoch hagolah." I am in exile. So, the Bal Tanya says that "Ani", the I is sometimes in exile. This is This is before Richard Schwartz IFS. "Va'ani betoch hagolah." I, the I is in exile. So, it's like a breaking point. And now the I that everybody knows is a different I. It's an I who's courageous and knows how to get validation and I know how to be successful and I get compliments and I'm loved in my community and I'm doing well in this area and in that area, but my real I is a mess. It's completely completely abandoned. I put it in a in a in a in a safe. I locked it. I threw away the key and I don't even go there. But we all feel the torturous dissonance that comes from that. Because Excellent. we did not have the ability to cry for our abandonment. Our tears were not welcome and we decided this is not a good way to survive. So, we create defense mechanisms and coping mechanisms. In in in Kabbalistic and Chassidic literature, it's called animal soul defense mechanisms that substitute our divine soul and our inner soul is completely completely hidden and repressed. So, what you're saying when we begin the process of grieving and crying, it's the beginning of resurrection. It's the beginning of restoration. So, you never have to be afraid of pain. Pain is painful. It's not scary. You never have to be afraid of confronting the loneliness cuz it's only in confronting that that I will ever be able to become a whole person. There's no reaching wholeness by continuing that repression. And that's why I could I salute this generation that is searching for this. So, what are What are What would be five tips? So, the first tip the Rov has explained, let's see, in building resilience is first understanding that our pain and our challenges is actually a strength. Our pain means we started feeling we're having a live of bus art. It's not a live Evan. It's not a Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, now that we have that, we're having we're getting several questions of people that they're asking about how do I build a resilience in myself? Like some someone shared that I have a son that has anxiety and he doesn't want to date. Like how can we start helping any one of us, let's take me for an example, there are certain things I would like to do, but I'm afraid or I'm hesitant. And by the way, just before the Rov answers the question, I need to give a very special shout-out to my mother. So, my mother's listening right now to the program and thank you for always being there and supporting me every step of the way. And sometimes we learn with behaviors of what you do when things are easy and then sometimes we also share when things are challenging. And when my father was nifter over 15 years ago to watch how it was painful and the loss for you and for the whole family, for everyone. And then now you're watching this program with your husband, with Vigdu, someone that I consider like my second father and compliments me and is there and supportive and always tell me I'm working too hard. So, first I just want to thank both of you for watching this, for being there. And I appreciate the support and the resilience that I have from you, Mommy, and from Vigdu for being there. So, thank you for that. And now to go to Rov. And by the way, those of you that can't watch, don't know what's happening, we have a false short sitting right next to me and I'm getting tapped on my back the entire time. And then he leans in on me and hugging me. And it's there's just a such a wonderful support, right, Refael? Yeah. Now, just just go tell everyone cuz everyone's listening. We have like many, many people. Just tell everyone how how you're giving everyone chizuk every day. Just share that one minute before we go there. Okay, so my my chizuk is that I thought I always think of Sam that every day that I'm keep learning and growing and since I'm learning wrong, I always tell myself I'm not here I'm not here myself. I'm here for a class wrong. I said put me in this room to learn and grow, to learn what my parents want me to do and so that to everyone that even though I'm misunderstanding one of the things they do, but the main thing I I I I I don't do myself I always tell myself I need to believe in it. I need to do everything I I can just so that I'm a grown-up. We want to help you we keep going going going going. So I want to take our Lexia ancestors that is so it and let's keep improving that we're learning and growing and doing what we don't want to do it. We out here so that I'm tired struggling counting. We got to go through therapy. We got to go through everything we got to do and then we got to sit and see the answer. Oh man, thank you Refael. Wow, here. You can listen beautiful and look Refael all the messages coming up. Refael is amazing. A shout-out to Refael and wow, he should bring Messiah. Look at all this. What? Refael, you're the best. Okay, Refael one more one more thing he wants to say okay and then we're going to go into Okay, Refael one more thing. I just want to thank you Sam that but truly that that that every day that I I'm I'm learning everything from my mutton. Thank you people for teaching me to be inspired. Wow, beautiful. Thank you. Beautiful. Thank you Refael. Thank you. Just think thank you. How do we start building this resilience within ourselves and within our children? And like when you shared that let's say you had anxiety, what is something that you did to over- What is something Yeah. What is something that the Rav has done to overcome his challenges, what resilience within himself, and what resilience can we recommend to others to build resilience in themselves and in their family? So, first is first of all something I still work on. It's not I snapped a finger, something I still work on. And I'm all very aware of. A few things that I that that I could suggest that I think are practical tools and I apply them to myself as well. I think the first thing is I'm not I'm here to talk really about my own personal life and my own process cuz I know what's what's very helpful for me. The first important thing is every one of us must have a support system. You know, we we can't be alone in this world. The first thing the Torah says is not good is for a person to be alone. Lo toyv y's Adam l'vado. It's the first thing Torah says is not good. Somebody once said the antithesis of addiction is not sobriety. The antithesis of addiction is attachment. We all need a support we all need people whom we trust. One person, two people, three people we could be completely open and transparent with and they can hold space for us. They can hold space for our pain, for our journeys, for our struggles, for our triumphs. That's number one. Number two, it's important for people to learn, I know for me this is critical, this is oxygen, how to get in touch with their soul. A relationship with the soul, with your divine soul, is everything cuz that's a relationship with your own life force and energy. Um This Friday is Yud Tes Kislev. Yud Tes Kislev is the Chag HaGeulah, the famous day of redemption of the Baal HaTanya when he was liberated from prison because they wanted to shut down the whole Chassidic movement. And the liberation he said represented heaven's permission to spread the mystical, deeper aspects of Torah. One of the most powerful ideas in the Tanya, which is celebrated on Yud Tes Kislev, is this. We all have coping mechanisms that come from our animal soul. Our animal consciousness needs to survive. Like a chimpanzee, like an elephant, like a rat, like a mouse, like a monkey, we all have a little monkey inside that needs to survive and we develop crazy coping mechanisms. This one becomes numb. This one becomes detached. This one is busy in flight, fight, freeze, fawn. We all This one is jealous. This one is busy with hate. And this one is just not feeling anything. But we're busy. We're triggered. Our coping mechanisms get triggered. For many years it's very easy, and I know for myself, to live in those coping mechanisms. And you just run from one distraction to another distraction to another distraction to another distraction. And sometimes the distractions are religious and holy, but they're distractions. The key of healing, what I learned is when I could go into a deepest part of me, which is my divine soul, your chelek Eloka mimaal mamash, and your divine soul is always wholesome. And it celebrates surrender, love, vulnerability, authenticity. It's like a flow from God in this world. And the more we could spend time with our divine soul rather than with our coping mechanisms, the more clarity and resilience you have because the soul, like it says about Hashem, we say in morning and davening from Tehillim, "Oiz v'chedva b'mimkomai." In God's space, there is confidence and joy. So whenever you're in your own divine space, you're confident and you're happy. It doesn't mean you don't have pain, but it means you have confidence and you have joy. So the path of cultivating resilience is to learn how to be able to make a shift from living in my coping mechanisms of my animal consciousness and learning how to cultivate a relationship with my divine consciousness. Now that is work of a lifetime, but there's a few very practical steps. The first thing is we have to be able to have a regulated nervous system. If my nervous system is anxious and uptight my amygdala as it's called is firing messages I'm not safe there's no way my animal soul is going to open up to my divine soul. It's too busy protecting itself. So there's something called regulation. Breathing processing the pain through your body. Don't be afraid of your pain. Process it. Breathe. Number two, don't be afraid of surrender. We don't have to understand life. Understanding is a form of control. Surrender control. Just breathe and realize you're a channel. Number three of these two first of all? Number one seems like such a powerful level that when a child let's say comes to you and saying, "Mommy or tatty, I had a hard time in yeshiva." Instead of fix it the first step is realizing it's okay to have a hard time. Yeah. Okay to be in a little pain. And we're not saying it's good that you're in pain, but we want to not develop a fear of pain. We want to be able to realize that we can tolerate it. It's uncomfortable. There are things that are uncomfortable. Work is uncomfortable. You know, waking up in the morning, waking up early is uncomfortable. Hashem made it that way. And now for all saying Hashem made it that way, exactly. And instead of like we can sympathize that it's hard that you have to get up early. I live in Lakewood and I drive to Muncie three times a week. It's over two hours each way during traffic. That's four hours a day. Now I could either be kvetching oy vey, it's so uncomfortable. I could look I have a zchus to help hundreds of people every single week. I have the zchus of bringing in the parnassah. I have the zchus of impacting therapists. So it's challenging. It's hard. So that's the first step. First step is to embrace pain as a given. It's okay and to we'll discuss I guess the rosh kollel explains how to actually develop that that it's okay with pain. But the first step is pain is a given and don't try to run away from that. And it's And it's reality. And it's a reality. And the second point that the rosh kollel is saying is that stop fighting it. Like sort of surrender and accept it. It's similar to embracing and to understand that it's not so scary as it is. Learn to make it your friend. Is that the number one and number two that the rosh kollel is saying? Yeah, yeah. And I think, you know, I think the more we do it, the more we get used to it. We also have to realize that our coping mechanisms and our different parts are very threatened by us not living in exile. You know, we all develop personalities that work. They're functional. And we run from distraction to distraction to distraction to protect ourselves. My wife may tell me something and I'm getting very triggered. There's a reason I'm getting triggered. There's something in me that felt unsafe. My teenage girl may say something to me. My teenage boy may say something to me. My little boy may say something to me or my adult child or a friend or neighbor or or sibling or whatever it is and I'm triggered. I'm very triggered. I'm like overwhelmed. And be curious what just triggered you. Wow, why did I just got so triggered? What just happened? Did somebody take a sword and put it in the chat your chest? It felt that way. Why? Why? What just happened? Instead of lashing out, you know, Victor Frankl said, "Between stimuli and reaction, there's a tiny little space, and that's where human freedom lives." You know, can I be curious? Like, what just happened? Wow, I was just triggered. And basically, there's hijackers inside of us that want to hijack our brain and hijack our soul and hijack our heart and take us down those rabbit holes, those neural pathways that we are accustomed to. So, I could just play out my role that I've been doing for 52 years. My wife says this, I get triggered, I become passive-aggressive, I say I have to go to my room, we get into an argument, I answer, I don't answer, I get upset, I go to my room, usually I go to my phone. Whatever it is, we all have our coping mechanisms. This one, you know, projective, this one goes, this one implode, this one explodes, this one runs away, this one, you know, detaches for four for four weeks. Whatever it is. And we could continue doing that. And you know what? It worked. But you'll see inside you're not happy. There's dissonance. You're you're not calm. Your your house is not a happy place. Your kitchen is not an exciting place. There's no energy that is deep and authentic and connecting because we're all coping. So, there's another path. And the other path is notice these triggers like, "Wow. Wow. Wow. I just got very very triggered." And when you could start noticing it and holding space for it with compassion. You need a lot of compassion because these triggers are really your friends in a crazy way. They think they're protecting you. They're trying to keep you safe in a crazy world. I promise you, nobody develops coping mechanisms for no reason. They have a strategy. I don't think it's a constructive strategy. It's not a strategy that's going to bring you to where you want to be, but it's a strategy, and you have to have empathy. And the more empathy you have, the more choice you have not to live there. You know, we we thought that guilting and shaming yourself and others is a guarantee for good behavior. opposite. The more guilt and shame, the more we remain stuck in our animal consciousness coping mechanisms, the more we remain detached from life, the more we remain estranged from Hashem. Guilt and shame is usually what blocks off all real awareness. There's no guilt and shame. It's empathy for the fact that I need to revert to these types of behaviors and triggers, and then I can choose to surrender, and I can choose, literally, to tune in to a different frequency in myself. It's the frequency of your neshamah, of your divine soul. And over there, you're very powerful. You don't need anybody. You don't need validation. Your ego is not wounded. You're not abandoned. In that space, you're a very very powerful, capable human being. You're full of joy, creativity, compassion, love, inquisitiveness, curiosity, and tremendous warmth and fearlessness. So, the resilience we're looking for, we don't have to create. It's all there inside of you. Your soul is very resilient. It's divine. It's as resilient as it gets. What we need to recognize is that we have blockages that have come to define us over many years, and we need to learn how to work through those blockages and find our song. And that's why it's important any healer you're dealing with if the conclusion is that you're just messed up we're not in the right direction. There's no such a thing you're messed up. They're not a roifer. They have a roifer. We're on a journey. We're all on journeys. And this journey is not a mistake. According to the Bala Tanya, we were created for this journey. Everybody has an animal consciousness that develops insane coping mechanisms. And our divine soul came into our bodies in order to work these things through, to work through your insecurities. The more you're scared of something it's probably closer. It's probably going to bring you closer to finding why you came into this world. Don't run away from it. Wow. So, just to summarize this, if we can actually take some of these concepts and put it into therapy words cuz some people over here are in therapy. So, I've heard a method a shtickel, the IFS model called internal family systems. Yeah. That method is talking about the self. And that method is talking about that there are different protectors out there that when we're afraid, all these protectors are trying to protect us but it's avoiding getting into the real self. And that's going to be the avoid to be able to experience the pain and to realize that we're in a higher helically came you mouth that nothing could ever touch that and we can go deep into that place. And when we can actually listen to what's really happening, not those distortions, blaming our wives, blaming our children, blaming our bosses, blaming Hashem, even rabbonim. Like it's about us us finding it. And us identifying it. Then I also heard the rov use the concept of the act therapy. Act steps for acceptance and commitment therapy. And that method is very much about it's a shtickel the opposite of cognitive behavioral therapy where you're fighting your thoughts. Act is about learning to accept that we're having certain feelings and it's painful and it's uncomfortable and with that we're still gaining so much and we're growing. So therefore the ACT therapy is about acceptance and commitment. Then the Rov has also shared about the CBT model about changing your thoughts, recognizing that this pain is not a problem. This pain is actually a success. This is where we're reframing it to a level that the challenges that you're having is mommish close to whatever ticken we're here to do. That's the aveda what that we're going through. Then I heard the Rov discuss a little sort of like trauma modalities from from EMDR which brings up the trauma. You're facing it. You're re-experiencing it but now in a safe mahalach, in a safe with a therapist, with someone there for you. And as you're reprocessing and re-experiencing that in the safety, you're now at a whole different level that you are so much more powerful and so much more stronger that once you've gone through it, you're now healed on a mahalach or or within yourself you're healthier. Uh Refael, you'd like to say something? Yeah. Yeah, go ahead then. I'm going to say Just move much closer. You have to speak in the microphone. I'm going to say it the same thing. So basically that we're all constantly we are we we're locked in in our in our struggle and our pain and challenge. But the only way to do to get out is is is telling ourselves we cannot let pain get down. We have to be in a safe environment. That mean that's why these opportunities that some gives us opportunity therapists and people that guide us from how we can change Thank you. guide us in a Excellent. safe way getting out of this. Beautiful, Refael. Now let me ask the Rov, um being that it's about an hour, I would like to start taking questions. But I know the Rov really wasn't feeling well. Are you up to taking some live questions? Yeah, let's do for 15 minutes. Okay. So, what we're going to offer right now for those of you that would like for those of you on the phone, you can press star nine and it will light up by us. For those of you that are on Zoom through the other method, you can press by react at the bottom sort of almost in the center of the screen. It's react to the bottom left. And there you press raise your hand and therefore comes up and we can ask some questions over here regarding we can speak to our by Y.Y. Jacobson regarding Here we go. We've got several people clicking up. So, this is again regarding resilience around any question that you would like. Whatever they'd like to ask, go ahead. Yeah. Any question. We can go ahead. So, let us start with the first person last digit six. Go ahead press star six actually to unmute yourself and then we will go to someone last digit nine. Shalom, and welcome to the program. Yes, so Welcome back, Rochelle. Ooh. Aryeh, hello. We have I have a special deal with Aryeh. That Aryeh gets to call, but he gets to speak to me one-on-one. Aryeh, it's a one-on-one program that we got. We are going then to our next caller, person with the last digit nine. Press star six to unmute yourself. Person last digit nine, there you go. Welcome to the program. Hello. Hello. Yes, hi. Hi. I would like to ask on resilience. If someone's in a situation, I give you one of three situations that it's a real painful situation. If let's say has in his family like three older daughters that are lined up and like the whole family's just living on the trauma that you know nothing's going for them or there's a sick parent in the family or they have a struggling son or daughter. Is it um, possible or expected that they should just pull through resilience? That means we understand Hashem gave us this message, so we make the best of it. Or is it also possible to still be able to function with a certain level of simcha? Does that also go into resilience? That not just we're just living with you know, we're just pulling through day-to-day like we spoke about the Holocaust. People after they survived, that's all they want, they even just to be able to pull through. But it wasn't a full living capability. They were living with the traumas. Or is it that we don't want to just keep on living in a state of trauma always? We want to be able, you know, how do you function? What would be the resilience to function? We understand we have a lot of tzaros, but we also were a happy family and we would like to pull through with happy times. Wow, that's a tough question. When someone is going through real pain, like you're sharing three daughters not married, nebach, there is an illness in the family, a very serious illness. Like are we expecting this person to just live or are we having expectation for them to have molei simcha and be excited? That is a question. Reb Yaya, what would you share? Yeah. So, I think, you know, it's when we speak about joy, resilience, and simcha, I think, again, resilience and joy I think are natural products of the soul. We don't have to create them. Whenever I'm in flow, when my soul is a in alignment, when I'm a channel for whatever my life force energy is, what Hashem is channeling through me, there's going to be resilience and there's going to be joy. Joy doesn't mean there's no pain. Joy doesn't mean I have control. Joy doesn't mean I understand. Joy means that I'm just in a space where I know that I'm safe. I'm in the right time, I'm in the right place, and I'm manifesting the amazing life force that's supposed to be manifested through me. Sometimes I just wrote something to this to somebody today, literally. The following question I wrote, "When your family is getting destroyed, what do you hold on to?" That's the question. Is there anything to hold on to? It looks like the family there's only one thing to hold on to. And that is your own infinity. What does it mean your own infinity? When we can have the courage to really surrender the need to understand and comprehend and analyze and dissect and the need to control, we can really go into a place of full vulnerability and surrender. There is also a very powerful joy and resilience that awaits us in that place. It's not a joy everything is perfect and rosy and dandy and it's works out. And I have to show up and do whatever I need to do to be able to help people with health, spiritual health, physical health, emotional health, shidduchim, whatever the crisis that I have to deal with. It's about being responsible. But in showing up, I could show up with desperation and the need to control the situation and figure it out and that's going to prove disastrous. Or I could show up with a much, much deeper sense of vulnerability and authenticity and tune into the frequency of faith and surrender. And there is a simcha over there, there is a bliss over there. Because whenever you're channeling Hashem's energy, God is the source of bliss and goodness and joy. And when you channel that energy, you're in a place of bliss. It's not a bliss cuz everything is perfect, it's a bliss because you're in a relationship with the ultimate source of bliss. I don't know if that makes sense, but that's what I have to say. Right. Basically, it sounds to me like you're saying that he realizes that this is the situation that Hashem wants and he has joy in doing the right thing. Um My question would also be is it beneficial? That means he's basically having both together. He has his tzar and his joy in that he knows he's, you know, Yeah. There's pain. There's pain because it's a painful situation. There's pain cuz it's a painful situation. And we want to show up, but you want to show up tzar, but he would try to push away as much as he could, like, you know, that he has pain. That means, "Okay, I'm living in a tzar, but, you know, still 10 hours of my day could be in complete joy. I could put it completely out of my mind." I don't know I don't know and I you want you want to keep check like I'll tell you something. You want to keep your heart open. When we when we sometimes throw things out of our mind, we also have to shut our heart. The moment we shut our heart, we shut our heart to the pain, we also shut our heart to the joy. We want to live with an open heart. To live with an open heart, we're going to feel pain. But what if we feel the pain, we can process the pain through our bodies. We can breathe and we can surrender our minds and our egos to Hashem and show up as a pure humble channel. And you'll see there's tremendous bliss in that experience. Death of ego is the most blissful thing in the world. And sometimes our challenges are what create the death of ego. So, they, paradoxically, become the source of our bliss. Do you understand what I'm saying? Yes, 100%. But death of ego is not an easy thing cuz our ego doesn't like that. Ego stands for easing God out. But death of ego is the source of all joy. So just clarify what the rough said, isn't it so profound and so powerful. Oh, sorry. Yes, Refael is leaving. So Refael, go ahead. Say goodnight everyone. Goodnight and thank you for inspiring me. Letting me talk here. That this whole thing of processing. Thank you so much to listen to me and to the world. Beautiful. Thank you, Refael. from Hashem cuz I didn't know you were coming and you came. So what a beautiful program. You did it for Hashem. Thank you. Hodu Lashem ki tov. So just repeating a a very star By the way, by the way, I just want to say everything we're talking about Refael is embodying. Yes. If you realize. Yes. I know he's not coming across as a polished speaker and as a certified therapist. But in a very deep way, you can see that he's embodying what we just spoke about. Right, Mordechai? When we hear Refael on other programs, he shares his pain. He shares how hard it is sometimes to wake up. Sometimes it's hard to listen to his mother. Sometimes it's hard to give in his cell phone to the Yeshiva when they ask for it. And he can cry and then he can be so positive and so exciting and so energizing. He's experiencing He's experiencing the flow of life in all of its complexity without the need to control it, which we all do constantly. We love controlling everything and it's a disaster. Yeah. Wow. Shkoyach and thank you for that beautiful question and beautiful power. We are going to the next person, LBZ. Um you can press unmute at the bottom and we look forward to taking your question. You're on with Rabbi YY Jacobson and Mordechai Weinberger here on Radio Kol Beramah Lakewood. Hi, Rabbi Jacobson. All your fear and over the last few years, it's really gotten me through some dark times. Can we also share about some of the funny scenes, Rabbi Rabbi why why I got to share with you a story that just about 3 weeks ago, there was a friend of mine that he was actually there his son was dating and it was getting a little questionable. He said this, she said that, I wasn't sure and then there is a wonderful wonderful program that I shared with many people. Will you share the man's brain is like a waffle and the wife's is like a spaghetti and it was so helpful for him to we could all know about it and sometimes laugh about that, but when you're in the parsha and you're starting to act with how different people look at things. Yeah. When she says inspiring, that was a um Yeah, listen, we all need some good humor. Yeah. You know, part of the soul is the part the part of the soul likes to laugh. So, let's remember that. The more you get in touch with the laughter inside of you, you know, the healthier we can all be. Yeah, go ahead. Did she finish? She's still on? She she's just started. Oh, okay. Uh okay. Um yeah, so I I Um I started struggling with my mental health at like 18. I'm 29 now. Um it's been a long painful journey. Uh I've done uh a lot of treatment centers and out patient centers. Um dealt with a lot of uh suicide stuff, uh addiction, eating disorders. Um I don't talk to my family anymore. Uh thank God I I'm doing a lot better than I was like 3 years ago, which was my first residential treatment center. Um but I still find every day to be a huge struggle. Um and like I try to listen to Sheurim and try to rely on Hashem and keep my bitachon strong. But like not being able to work or like constantly feeling unstable emotionally makes it hard to get get like an income. So then that like increases my mental health struggles. Um So I guess and like I have a support system, thank God. But there's like so much they can do, you know, they can't like book me Ubers everywhere to all my appointments and they can't like order me food every time, you know, there's there's only so far they can go. They can't like support my every need. Um so I guess I just I feel and like and I understand like I I know like when your bitachon is like on point, like I know Hashem gives you everything you need, but you know, like every day I might be talking on isn't going to be perfect. So then I'm like Hashem matches your bitachon and your reliance. So those day like the days I'm off and I'm like relying on people and not on Hashem, then I'm just like, you know, he's not I don't know, I'm not getting the things that I need in order to heal. So that makes my mental health worse. Um I guess my question is I'm at a point where like I just I feel stuck. I feel like I'm trying to push the rock up a mountain and like I it just keeps falling on me and I'm like getting nowhere. And I just I I know what to do anymore. Right. First of all, I'm so so sorry. One thing that's maybe practical I would suggest is to build a schedule of the day that you have found in the past that has made you the most energetic every and have given has given you the most stamina. For example, I know in my life, right? If I wake up after a certain time and the first thing is I'm on my phone and answering emails and then reading something and then reading something else, by the time 12:00 comes, I'm disoriented and I'm not in touch with my soul and it's the day becomes much harder. But if I'm disciplined, I know what is it that I need to oxygenate my neshama. I know what it is for me. You know, and every person has their path. You know, one person needed to wake up in the morning and do exercise or journal or dance or stretch, you know, do yoga, do Pilates, listen to music, meditate, davin, learn, learn a certain type part of Torah that speaks to your neshama, take a walk, take a hike, whatever it is. Look at the days that you have been the most successful and productive internally and stick to that in a very very disciplined, routine way even if your defense mechanisms and your emotions are chaotic and they don't want you to do that because there's always an excuse. I wake up, oh, I have to answer a text. Oh, somebody's calling me. Oh, I have to take care of an email. Oh, there's an interesting article about Israel that I have to read. Oh, there's a great clip. I can't miss that. And 2 hours later, I'm still on the phone. So, be very disciplined about it, but look at a day of yours where you felt that you were living with more bitachon, you had more energy, you had more serenity, you had more resilience, and make that a disciplined routine unless there's an emergency, and really stick to it, and you'll probably see a big difference. That would be my suggestion. You take responsibility for your schedule. For example, some people in the morning when they learn Torah, let's say they learn Hasidus, which is Jewish spirituality, which I do every single Oh, I do almost every single morning. It It feeds my soul. My soul becomes alive. Now when I daven, I can daven with more sincerity. Then afterwards, I could learn with more passion. And then I can go on with my other day responsibilities, and I'm focused. I'm centered. So that's what you want to make sure Own your mornings and your schedule, and I believe that things could work out much better than you can imagine. Thank you. I appreciate that. Sure. Can I also take a completely different, um, place? Because you've mentioned so many real, intense challenges, and I'm hearing from your question there was, let's say, areas where you would like to have your family help you, and there's just limits to what they can help you. So Oh, no. I don't I don't talk to my family. Like I chose not to talk to them because it was an unhealthy, uh, relationship. Wow. Wow. Yeah. I think she meant I think she meant not her family, but like friends who do support her. But they can only support her in a limited way. Yes. No, like a Jewish organization helps me. Okay. Okay. I I think Rabbi YY Jacobson has said it all. I am just having that routine, knowing to tune into what works for you, starting to stay focused on that. And respect your soul Respect your soul. It's always about self-respect. You know, we don't learn a lot about self-respect. We learn about respecting others. We learn about loving others. We need to learn about self-respect and self-love. Not in a narcissistic way. In a responsible way. When I respect myself, I respect what I eat, what I don't eat, what goes into my mouth, what doesn't go into my mouth, what comes out of my mouth, what doesn't come out of my mouth. Where I spend my time cuz I respect myself. You know, how often I take a shower, how I get dressed. How I when I exercise. It's all when you have self-respect. But this I have to own myself. We have to all also remember something. Somebody once told this to me actually. A woman, a very special person told this to me. She struggled a lot in her life and she said, "You know, one day I realized that when I die and come to heaven, nobody's going to pat me on my back and say, 'Wow, you were such a good victim. You know, you suffered so, so well. We're so proud of you for being such a nebakh case.' And she said, 'And then I realized, you know why nobody's going to do that? Cuz it's my choice.' And it changed her life. Now, it's it's it's a very, I'm telling you, it's not such an easy thing to do because I found by myself and I think by others, we have a certain dependability on pain. There's something romantic about being in pain. You know, when you're in pain, you're you're dramatic, you have depth, you have color. You're interesting. We also don't want to let go of our pain because pain is the witness to abuse. Right? People don't want to let go of pain cuz if I let go of pain, who is going to be the witness to all the craziness that I experienced, to all the abuse? And therefore, we insist on holding on to our pain to our own detriment. And I want to say this to all of us and also to you and to myself. It's very normal, but that's not the way to live. We always have a right to feel pain. We don't need to hold on to our stories. Not only that, we will always be a witness to the abuse. We don't have to hold on to the stories. But by holding on to the pain and insisting that this is who we are, we don't allow ourselves to live in the frequency of surrender, trust, faith, and bliss. So, there comes a time where we want to take responsibility for our lives and say, "Of course I've been through pain. Of course I've been abandoned. Of course I suffered terribly. Of course I developed some crazy habits. Of course so many years were dysfunctional. But you know, I've learned to process it and to tune into my frequency of surrender, vulnerability, trust, love, and faith. And I'm not defined by pain anymore. I'm defined by creativity, by joy, by bliss, by self-actualization, and by humility, and by being an ambassador of God. Do I have pain? Yeah. Can I talk about it? Yeah. Can I be there for other people in pain? Yeah. And it's a very, very big and profound existential shift that I know is not easy to make. And I don't judge when somebody doesn't make it because it makes a lot a lot of sense. But I think when we really have self-respect, we're not afraid to make that shift. And that's what the woman told me. She said, "I realized it's my choice, and I don't want to come to the next world somebody patting me on my back, you were an unbelievable victim." Wow. Beautiful. And I think the way LBZ sounds, she is not a victim. She is powerful. She's making choices to Yeah. stand up and to move forward. So, I guess one at a time, one step at a time. And and every morning, you know, I have to ask myself and you should it's a good question ask yourself, is my next choice coming from deep self-respect or from or not. In other words, whatever I'm now about to do for the next hour, I may make a call, I may go here, I may go there, is it coming from one of recognition that I am infinite, that I have absolute non-negotiable value? Cuz if it's not coming from there, it's coming from my protective coping mechanisms. Wow. So powerful. Let us go to iPhone. Person iPhone is And again, whoever would still like to ask their questions, um either press reaction at the bottom, it lights up, or from your calls, press star not from your phone, it lights up by us. iPhone, welcome to the program. And you're on with Radio Kol Ramah Rabbi Weiss. Hi. Hi, how are you? Hi. Um basically, I want to know, I've been listening to like a lot of podcasts and like from like Meaningful Minute and Rabbi Weiss and Rabbi Jacob saying I was listening to yours also. It's very, very nice and interesting. And like I was always telling myself like oh my gosh, like I have to be grateful. I can't complain. Like like I have parents, I have hands, I have I could see, whatever it is. And all the podcasts that I would see, like they would be missing a parent, they lost a sibling. And I'm like I can't complain. But then on the other hand, like they always speak of like how they have like all the support like in the world. And it's like I don't have like supportive parents at all. Like I was just sick. My parents like didn't care. I had to go to the doctor myself. Uh friends, I didn't have any friends. I don't like have any like like I dropped out of school. Like I'm not in school because of it. And it's just like I don't have anybody around me and I'm going through so much, one thing after the next. And it's just like I don't know. And I don't have like the people like around me like support me. And like I don't know. It's like And it's like been going for like the longest time. And like when I'm having a hard day, I don't have like who to like reach out to. I don't have a friend that I could just rely on. Like call her and be like, "Hi, like you want Can we talk?" So it's very like hard. Like could you give me like any like things that I could do? Like I don't know. I'm like stuck. I don't have like supportive parents. It's not like I could even like talk to them. I'm by myself and my phone all day. Wow. How old are you? 17. Wow. Um first of all, I'm so sorry. That's very very painful. I'm very sorry. Listen, the fact that you're grateful for all the gifts that you have is an amazing quality, but it doesn't mean that you're not experiencing pain for all the things that you crave and you miss and you yearn. Yeah. Right. What I would suggest is to try to develop some type of friendships. Try to develop some type of relationships. Is there maybe a sibling? Is there maybe an uncle, an aunt, a cousin, an old friend from school? I don't have any of that really. Like I have a sister that's a year older than me, but she The only things that she tells me is like do the calendar, you didn't do your job. I'm going to tell mom you're on your phone too much. Like just that. Like I don't Like I really don't have anyone. Like I don't know. Like the things that I try to do when I'm in a bad mood is like whatever, take a shower, do my things. And like sometimes I like listen to music. And at some point I was like I donate money because they're Like they're going through a hard time right now. I'll be like let me donate to organization that helps sick children cuz if I'm not happy now, maybe I can make someone else happy. But none of these stuff help. And also I feel like I'm such a holy girl. Like I go to school every Shabbos. I I have been learning Torah every single day, every day, every night. Nishmas, Parshas Hashavua. I finished the whole thing like weekly. Like I was saying like I was like what does Hashem want from me? Like I'm saying like I don't know. I don't feel like I deserve it though. Can I maybe recommend just go there? Is there anyone as you're saying there's nobody you could connect to and in therapy and very much what Rabbi YY Jacobson has been speaking this evening is about being able to take a step that's maybe very hard and seeing where the challenge is. As you're saying you're very alone, not close to your family, dropped out of school, don't have friends, not able to connect to anyone. And in therapy, to us, that is probably one of the most important skills to learn is like to be able to at least connect to a therapist where you feel that it's confidential, they're here for you, but if there's anyone. So, without going much more into this further, I would I think Rabbi YY Jacobson has said it all, and you're so brave and so powerful for all that you're doing. But I I wonder is it possible to take the next step of who you can open up to and who you can trust? I do. I go to therapy, and I even paid for it myself cuz my parents don't know, whatever it is, but I do it. And are able to take that step of trusting now the therapist? I do. I I opened up to her, but I'm still I can't like rely on her 24/7. Like I see her once a week. I saw I haven't actually seen her today, but it's like once a week. I can't just like She's not like my friend. I can't just like call her when I'm having a hard day. It's not like No, I'm sorry. Let me clarify. The goal was for you to bring this up with a therapist and help you identify what you can help. Like how can you connect because there might be one person that you can. So, thank you. I really appreciate your call. I appreciate you listening, and know that you're asking all the right questions, and maybe we don't have the answer, but from the questions like this is where we get to the answers. So, thank you. I I really appreciate you calling up. Wow. Beautiful. Let us go to our next caller, a person with the last digit four. Hi, you're on with Rabbi YY Jacobson and Mordechai Weinberger. Yes, hi. Yes, thank you for pressing star six. Hello? We're hearing a lot of feedback background. Do you hear me? Yes. We hear you, yeah. Yeah. Um I wanted to bring up What does a person How is a person What does a person do when they find themselves in like in a depression? And everything just seems dark. What would be advice for such a person? Reb YY, would you like to take this? I think First of all is the greatest power of depression is that it says there's nothing else. I'm depressed, depressed, depressed. So, I think the first thing is the fact to notice that there's an eye observing the depression. I don't know if you understand what I'm saying. But, whenever I'm experiencing something, let's say I'm experiencing a particular trigger or live depression. There is an eye that is noticing I'm depressed. I am empty. If my totality was depression, it would just be depression. Like if a vessel is broken, it's broken. There's no eye that notices it's broken cuz it's just broken, right? If your phone is broken, your computer is broken, your car is broken, it's broken. Why is it that when a person is broken, I know that I'm broken? Because the eye that observes your depression is not depressed. The eye that observes your brokenness is not broken. The eye that observes your loneliness is not lonely. So, that's the first thing. Remember that there's an eye beyond the depression that is noticing the depression. You get what I'm saying, my friend? Yes, I understand. That's number one. Actually, you. So, that's number one. Number two, once you realize this try to build on the fact that there's a core that's not depressed. How do you do that? So, you do it by every day taking one thing, one one experience that does speak to you. I'm sure in your life was there ever something that did something for you. Maybe running, maybe dancing, maybe basketball, maybe a hike, maybe exercise, maybe journaling, writing, music, speaking, teaching, learning something, meditation, breathwork, or any experience in life, going do volunteer work that spoke to you. And put that into your schedule and build on that. And I think that's a good foundation to begin making changes because depression doesn't want us to make changes. It just wants us to stay stuck. But it starts with a small thing. Every single day go to that moment in your life or whoever you're asking for where there was something that that did mean something to you. And do that every single day. Just start building on that. And then you build a foundation that gets healthier and healthier. Mhm. Can I Can I add one more question that Sure. um similar. So, like a lot of times, let's say someone has a specific pain, they could tap into a moon of a token to energize them. And they could grow from the pain. But it seems to me, at least, that like when someone's in a depression, the the pain pain is so deep, they feel so far from everything, especially Hashem, they can't they can't even tap into a moon of a token. Meaning a a a simple person, maybe someone very high in their major could um how should what how should a person view this? Meaning what does Hashem want from such a person? After all, Hashem is the one that has everything and he is the one that um he is without Hashem there wouldn't be the depression. What does Hashem want such a person to do? Yeah, it's very hard to know exactly what Hashem wants, but I think when we are in a state of depression, you're right. It's very hard to tune into a Mona Betcha. We need to be able to find ourselves before we're going to find God. Uh-huh. Um if I could sort of add on to this little concept and then we're going to go to our next caller. Um about depression and I wonder what happens if we take it on a clinical level. What are you doing about the depression? Means almost imagine there is I like considering or thinking about depression like a pilot light on a gas oven. When the light is out, when the fire is out and what Rabbi YY was was discussing like how can we get that lit by exercising, davening, what gives you a passion, what gives you an excitement? But I wonder if I would ask you, what has this person done already to get it going? Yeah. Sometimes a person need therapy, sometimes they might need a little medication. It could be on a biological level. It could be other things that are going on. Like we don't make assumptions. But what would you say this person needs to do? You're asking me? Yeah. Yeah, um I mean I'm talking about let's say in a case where the person tried medicine. They didn't have success with it. Um is trying therapy, but like we know therapy's not from one day to the next, so it's a process. It take a year, two years and while the person's going through that process um Forgive me for my ADD kicking in. Couldn't we hold back when we say therapy takes a year or two? It does, but it doesn't. Means I'll speak dialectic. It might take two years to get to the end, but you're supposed to be seeing results quicker. You're supposed to be noticing that things are moving. So So, are things moving? Are they noticing it? And if not, then therapists would recommend sometimes medication, sometimes different modalities, exercise. Sometimes a person might need more than once a week. Mhm. So, what I I mean that you're doing to deal with the depression. What is the therapist saying? Do you know the amount of times that us therapists were making recommendations where we're what's happening is sort of like as Rabbi YY has shared just before that there is so much happening, so much going on. Like, are we taking the steps? Are we doing little behaviors? Or the story that he shared that after 120, we don't want to be told we're right that we were a victim. So, my question is and that's if I would say there are if there's a one type of clients that we usually don't take in Serenity are those that are staying in victim status. By us, no matter what you're going through, we're willing to work on it. But, there's got to be an intention that may I will get better. If we're stuck into I can't get better, my environment can't. There's a saying, I think it was from Henry Ford, if you believe you can and if you believe you can't, you're right. And we are willing to go into show with anyone that would like to heal, but you got to have that attitude that I want to get better. It's a famous old fight in psychology that's called positive psychology which shifted that where they realized it's something interesting. If a client comes in every week saying how sad and how stuck they are, they will get more stuck going to therapy because you're focused on the negative. And positive psychology, the of positive psychology is a person who comes saying, "I'm depressed, but I want to get healthier. I want to get happier. I want to be productive. I want to make friends. I want to be happy." Once your focus is what I want in the positive mode, then people can start getting out of it. So, I would ask you again, what is this person with depression? What's the attitude? What are they doing? What positive steps are they taking? And it can be small and simple and easy. But, what are they doing? Yes. I mean, I'm talking about a situation where the person does have the attitude that they want to get better. Um they they let's say they did try therapy. And although you said that the result you should see results right away, I think it's probably depends on what what is causing the depression. If the person has a deep trauma from like their childhood, and a lot of stuff need to get unraveled and clarified. The person has to process that. I don't think it's true that the person right away would feel or right away would feel the depression go away. There's for sure going to be somewhat of you know, for sure meaning it's very possible there could be somewhat of depression that stays with the person for a while till they fully heal. True, but let's hold on. I like focusing. Forgive me for being a therapist now. I like focusing on the strength. I don't mind hearing deep trauma. I don't mind hearing long-term trauma. I don't mind hearing the person might need 5 years of therapy. I don't even mind hearing a person might need an IOP intensive outpatient program or a PhD or partial hospitalization program. I don't have an issue with any of that. But, the focus is still on building up. What is that person gaining weekly in therapy? What is that person doing daily? It's a strengths-based perspective. It's climbing up. Sometimes climbing up we're going down steps. But, it's about a strength. And I so far haven't heard what is that person doing to get out? What little steps are they doing? Let it take years. What are they doing? Um yeah, let's say the person who does exercise. That could be Excellent. Now, are they doing it daily? How do they feel when they're doing this? Beautiful. You're getting a lot of feedback. People are sharing as follows, I think that when someone feels stuck, they feel helpless, and perhaps it's because of deep trauma. I don't think it's fair to say the individual is going to dig themselves deeper. They simply need encouragement, and talking from my personal experience, absolutely. And that's what the therapists do. We encourage. But we also encourage with an intention. Intention is to get out. Intention is to move. Awesome. Thank you. Rabbi YY, I've gotten a message from someone saying that you wanted to end or to finish. Do you want to go another 10 minutes, or do you want to end? We've got two more people on. I I personally I'm not feeling so well. So, I'm going to say goodbye to everybody, and I thank you for the blessing and opportunity. Excellent. Wonderful. And we're going to keep this program going. So, for those that would like to stay on for another 20 minutes, a half hour. Rabbi YY, thank you for coming on. Shkoyach for the deep insights. Thank you, Reb Mordechai. Thank you for all the incredible work you're doing on behalf of our people with so much empathy and love and connection and caring. I will just share with you there are two questions that take it for granted. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And I appreciate the relationship, and I appreciate the ability to reach out to you, and the chizuk that you give me and the inspiration. So, thank you for that. I will share that there are two questions that people have asked me several times. One was about breath work, and another one has asked about psychedelics. So, both of them we have not touched, and we will not touch, but just saying this has come over. I've gotten three messages regarding each of those. So, just as we're closing, people said you are the right person and I'm doing this program for over 12 years and the level of pain that people have been having or sharing is you have a way of reaching so many people that are calling and I appreciate that and appreciate how you're able to touch those people in in some of the hardest places. So, thank you for being you and for coming on and really doing this program when you weren't feeling well. Have my shul and my privilege and may we all continue to be ambassadors for divine love, light, hope, healing, and redemptive consciousness. Amen. Amen. Have a wonderful evening. Shkoyach. And help for personal last digit nine then we'll go to personal last digit two. Um for those of you that would like um go ahead you can press star nine or by react, you can press the button react and raise your hand and we'll take your question. Personal last digit nine, welcome to the program. Hi. First of all, thank you so much for bringing us Rabbi Jacobson. I really enjoyed it and I'm looking forward to hearing it again. Thank you. Um I would have loved to ask my question when he was still on, but I'm I know. I know. I'm so humbled continuing this um without Rabbi Jacobson. I It's I've learned so much just by being on with him. So, thank you. So, what's if a far fifth place It's on the same topic of resilience and whatever how he put it and it was such a eye-opener for me to hear. Um It It It was good for me to hear. On the other hand, I It is one of my struggles. I find out and I'll tell you what my question is. That I before I went to therapy I was tougher, stronger. I felt like I came into therapy with just like a few things to take care of and and I'm fine. And I started therapy and I saw that I was not as fine as I feel that I was then. Um facing a lot of things that weren't okay and people that weren't